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  • I mean, I know Asuna is strong, but I've always assumed Kirito was stronger. And maybe this was true in SAO. But when Kirito and Zekken fought, she did not ask Kirito for help. But she asked Asuna. I know Kirito wasn't using Dual Blades and fighting like in SAO or old ALfheim Online against Oberon (to protect something or in a life-or-death situation), but he did say he wasn't holding back, and Asuna wasn't that desperate or giving it her all either (I mean, as in like a real life-or-death battle like in SAO). So, since they were both slightly but almost equally holding back when they each fought Zekken, but she chose Asuna over Kirito to help her, does it not lead to the conclusion Asuna pushed her further, and is thus the stronger warrior?

    I've noticed a trend in which Kirito is slowly becoming portrayed as weaker. His battle with Death Gun (Red-Eyed XaXa) in GGO was just lame. He was supposed to be better at swords, difference in quality of weaponry shouldn't have made that much of an impact that he was cut all over while Death Gun was barely fazed. I mean, that time when he fought in ALfheim Online against General Eugene, considered the strongest ALO player at the time, with the second most legendary sword in the game, Demonic Sword Gram, which could phase through objects, and yet he managed to beat him with inferior n00b equipment. I don't like OP MCs too much, but still, I'd like them to at least be the strongest in the relative peer group, even if they can't beat boss monsters solo with one-hit-kills D:

    Well, it is explainable why Kirito would lose to Yuuki, with his stats reset when switching to ALO, having real world issues to deal with while Yuuki had 3+ years of experience from many different MMO's without ever disconnecting (she did character conversions so while she spent only a few months on ALO, she had years worth of stats from other similar games). Also, Kirito's main true unique skill is his sheer willpower, seeing as he was getting beaten by Heathcliff and Oberon almost one-sidedly bad but he refused to give up. I'm sure he wasn't treating this as a similar situation. But the thing that bugs me is how is Asuna stronger? Is it because she didn't reset her skills? Or is she just simply stronger?

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    • Asuna and Kirito are pretty close in strength, to the point that each of them is always saying that the other is stronger. Kirito happens to have a few more tricks that can throw people off guard, but in combat ability it's never made clear which is stronger.

      Zekken chose Asuna over Kirito, simply because Kirito had noticed that she was a "resident of the world," and she didn't want to be around him for too much longer.

      When it came to the fight with Death Gun and Kirito, you really can't say it had to do with weapon quality: After all, Kirito only landed one hit, and that insta-killed XaXa. You can either say that it's because Kirito got rusty, XaXa got stronger, or from the beginning XaXa was already stronger, and Kirito only beat him in SAO because of the massive level difference. It could be either of those 3 options.

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    • You missed the part where Yuuki specifically said that she did not choose Kirito because he figured out her secret. So, your assumption is entirely misguided.

      As for your comments on XaXa, if you compare a person who has pretty much laid back for an entire year and a person who has been specifically practicing his skills in the virtual world, of course the one who was laid back will do worse. One's skills are only sharp as long as they are used. XaXa specifically commented that Kirito was awfully rusty after a year and that his SAO self would have been ashamed of him.

      And as for who's stronger, both Kirito and Asuna think that the other is stronger than them, so you could say that they are on a similar level.

      Edit: TUSF, you beat me to the post... -_-

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    • TUSF wrote:
      You can either say that it's because Kirito got rusty, XaXa got stronger, or from the beginning XaXa was already stronger, and Kirito only beat him in SAO because of the massive level difference. It could be either of those 3 options.
      Gsimenas wrote:
      As for your comments on XaXa, if you compare a person who has pretty much laid back for an entire year and a person who has been specifically practicing his skills in the virtual world, of course the one who was laid back will do worse. One's skills are only sharp as long as they are used. XaXa specifically commented that Kirito was awfully rusty after a year and that his SAO self would have been ashamed of him.

      Ah, yeah, both of them raise valid points. Thanks! Except it makes it even worse as one hit from Kirito KOing XaXa meant he even had the superior weapon. Also, Kirito still played ALfheim online regularly, so it doesn't make sense that he is so extremely rusty.

      However, I'm not talking merely virtually. In ALfheim arc, Kirito kicks Sugou's ass irl (which is actually somewhat reasonable as the pain resistance was set at zero in their battle earlier online, which in theory would have affected his real body as according to the man himself). On the other hand, Kirito was likely still suffering from muscle atrophy and wasn't at top physical condition. But after the BoB, when he goes to Sinon's house, he gets beaten by Shinkawa, a medical student that devoted all his time to grinding and farming in GGO, well, the times he isn't hitting on Sinon that is. In the very beginning, Kirito caught him by surprise and kneed him full force in the face at the beginning of the fight. Out of all the fights in this series that Kirito should have lost, this is the one fight that it makes little sense that he did lose. This was a fight in which he had determination and was at theoretical physical peak. Kirito was decent at Kendo, as Kirito's spar with Sugou, the latter who was a Kendo practitioner while Kirito had only done it very long ago, not counting his virtual swordsmanship skills, shows. This shouldn't be possible unless a part of system-assisted skills translate to actual physical skill, which is entirely plausible. Thus, Kirito's "Martial Arts" Extra Skill from SAO should have given him at least some degree of close-combat knowledge/instinct. Sure, this may not be relevant to the original question, just an offhand comment on the trend.

      Gsimenas wrote:
      You missed the part where Yuuki specifically said that she did not choose Kirito because he figured out her secret. So, your assumption is entirely misguided.

      She did? I didn't know that haha. So I can assume Kirito is at least stronger than Asuna, perhaps.

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    • As we've said, both of Kirito and Asuna are on the same level and it has never been made clear which one of them is stronger.

      And yes, lovey dovey time sure helps with keeping your skills high. Just because he still plays the game doesn't mean that he puts in that much effort in keeping his skills in check. XaXa on the other hand had nothing better to do.

      Really, you're bringing up Nobuyuki as an example? Do we really need to explain why he's not really a good example? As for the fight with Kyouji, Kazuto was caught off guard by an aggressive psychopath and before he could react, Kyouji seemingly injected him with a drug that would have killed him. Knowing that, I'm thinking that the thought that he was going to die made him stop fighting back. So, think of it this way, if you were attacked by ferocious animal, would you be on the defensive or offensive? I personally believe that the majority would be on the defensive. And the defensive was what led to Kyouji getting the opening he needed.

      And yes, if you were paying attention, she did explain that even in the anime. In episode 20 to be more specific.

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    • Gsimenas wrote:
      As we've said, both of Kirito and Asuna are on the same level and it has never been made clear which one of them is stronger.

      And yes, lovey dovey time sure helps with keeping your skills high. Just because he still plays the game doesn't mean that he puts in that much effort in keeping his skills in check. XaXa on the other hand had nothing better to do.

      Really, you're bringing up Nobuyuki as an example? Do we really need to explain why he's not really a good example? As for the fight with Kyouji, Kazuto was caught off guard by an aggressive psychopath and before he could react, Kyouji seemingly injected him with a drug that would have killed him. Knowing that, I'm thinking that the thought that he was going to die made him stop fighting back. So, think of it this way, if you were attacked by ferocious animal, would you be on the defensive or offensive? I personally believe that the majority would be on the defensive. And the defensive was what led to Kyouji getting the opening he needed.

      And yes, if you were paying attention, she did explain that even in the anime. In episode 20 to be more specific.

      Hmm, so Asuna and Kirito are on the same level? I find myself doubting that for some reason. I can't seem to think up of any evidence to support this claim, so I guess it's just a delusion cause I like Kirito as a character more. Not just because he's the MC and 'teh l33t hero', or because I don't like Asuna or anything. I dunno, I find Sinon more of a badass.

      I'm on episode 19. Just the part where she takes Asuna up. It made me curious so I looked for spoilers while 20 was downloading, which I'm about to watch. So yea, thanks for telling me that. Well, I know Nobuyuki wasn't exactly a shining example, as I've said earlier (pain tolerance was sent to 0 and he was cut in half, not to mention his mental condition probably wasn't up to par), however it must be taken into account that Kirito was still having muscle atrophy and such, and not up to par in terms of physical conditioning. And then he once again jumps into ALO, spending most of his time there, before he could get in shape properly.

      And yes, that Kyouji thing is much more reasonable now. I was pretty stupid for not catching that.

      He wasn't exactly all being 'lovey dovey'. As the extra after Season 1 shows, he still went on difficult quests and stuff. Sure, the threat of death wasn't hanging over his head, and he had no real need to level up and get stronger unlike XaXa, who, as you said, 'had nothing better to do'. I'm just saying even if he didn't become better while XaXa did, the amount of practice he was estimatedly getting shouldn't have dulled his abilities that far, as XaXa had said. Perhaps XaXa merely percieved Kirito as so much weaker because he himself had gotten so much stronger since SAO. It's just hard to believe Kirito had fallen in skill to the point his past enemies now mock his weakness. Maybe because Kirito is the MC and I'm just subconsciously raising him on an invincible pedestal.

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    • Most of the top players in ALO are at around the same level. But anyway, if you've only watched the anime, then you probably won't hear much of Kirito's side. But if you go beyond the anime, you would know that in some instances, he was only able to beat Asuna because of using tricks to confuse Asuna (ME1 for example). So yes, they are around the same level.

      You're forgetting the fact that Nobuyuki doesn't even know how to swing a sword properly. Although virtual abilities don't carry over to the real world, a person used to battles is much more likely to be alert and have at least some idea what to do in a fight than some showoff who has never even held a weapon in his life.

      I didn't say that he doesn't take part in quests at all. If you read Rainbow Bridge, you'd know that he actually does still do some overnight grinding to catch up to the others. But tell me this, how many scenes have you seen him actually doing something and how many scenes have you seen him either sleeping, resting, having lovey dovey time or the last two at the same time? Even the other girls complain that the last one is very common. So, my point is, Kirito spends far less time on grinding than he used to in SAO, since he has real life and even in-game he spends a lot of time either with Asuna or just resting. Couple that with his life not being on the line and you get that his skills became rusty.

      Of course, XaXa did spend a lot of time honing his skills, so his perspective isn't awfully reliable, but it's still enough to understand that Kirito isn't at the level of his SAO days.

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    • This is awfully late, but I'll chip in anyway... characterization is never Reki's forte... He keeps writing as if there are bunch of people stronger or equal to Kirito either in his own narration or through Kirito's thought, starting from Asuna, Yuuki, Eugeo, Alice, etc. But matter of fact is, we all know that when the plot calls for it, Kirito would easily surpass them in skills and strength. And this is not some mundane plot armor, it is in Kirito's nature that not only he is incredibly apt in gaming, he is also incredibly resourceful and sly, it is within his character to win all his battles. So far, only one person has ever bested Kirito and that's Heathcliff (then again, Heathcliff is broken from the get go).

      I also want to raise a point here, in a thread that has already been closed about how come Kirito could have lost to Yuuki... No one seems raise the point that Yuuki was using a medicuboid. A VR interface much stronger and advanced than Amusphere, even Nerve Gear. It is even mentioned in the novel (I think?) that the medicuboid gives it user better dive experience than Amusphere and Nerve Gear. But anyway, at the end of the day, word of god himself, in an interview when asked what would have happened if Kirito had been dual-wielding, Reki himself said that Kirito would have lost. But I personally don't buy it... Reki was simply using a cheap way to cement Yuuki's legend and to bring a character he regretfully made to OP, down to earth. 

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    • 203.176.181.37 wrote:
      But matter of fact is, we all know that when the plot calls for it, Kirito would easily surpass them in skills and strength.

      Not quite. Whenever the plot calls for it, he doesn't get some unexplained boost in skill or anything. It's always someone else coming in to rescue him.

      Edit: To illustrate my point:

      • In the rematch against Heathclif, Kirito was badly losing, and even fucked up fatally, and would have died. Until Asuna blocked a hit that probably would have killed him. And he got a chance to finish Heathcliff off when his guard was down.
      • While Sugou himself isn't a great fighter, there's still the point that, when Sugou had cornered Kirito to the point he couldn't do any more, Heathcliff shows up, and gives him admin access.
      • Against Death Gun too, he couldn't land a single hit on him. He was being pushed back at every turn, and slashed about wildly. He had a One-hit-kill sword, and couldn't hit him at all. The only reason he won that match was because of Sinon, who managed to feint him into retreating, which left him with an opening.
      • Then there's Kyouji, where in one hit, Kazuro was down, and he only made it through the night because Shino smashed a stereo over his head.

      Even in Alicization he doesn't win too many fights on his own, after entering the tower. In fact, at every turn, he would have been dead if Eugeo wasn't there. And ultimately, he couldn't even kill Quinella after going all out—she died by a complete twist of fate—a fluke killed her.

      in an interview when asked what would have happened if Kirito had been dual-wielding, Reki himself said that Kirito would have lost.
      Recently, a fan asked him about this on Twitter, and he responded that Exaclibur's stat advantage probably would have made a difference.
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    • Thank you.  I get so sick of people making the false accusation that Kirito is OP or some Gary Stu when most of his victories have been very close calls or attributed to someone helping him.  When he fought Illfang, he needed the entire group of players to coordinate together in order to beat it (this isn't illustrated in the anime where it just came down to him and Asuna, but in the LN, it is a group effort). Both Nick the Renegade and Gleam Eyes took him down to a mere sliver of health when he went at them alone(in the latter case, he had the assistence of Asuna and Klein). To add to it, he was nearly killed by Kuradeel until Asuna saved him. Also, when he and Asuna went up against the Fatal Scythe, a Boss that brought them down to half of their health even when they were blocking in one hit, both of them would've have been killed if Yui hadn't stepped in and saved them both by killing the monster with her Object Eraser.  

      And to add the point about Kayaba, if he wasn't such a good sport about it, he could've easily had the NerveGear fry Kirito's brain after he technically lost. Just to put that out there. 

      In the Fairy Dance Arc, He wouldn't have defeated Eugene if he hadn't taken Suguha's sword to Dual Wield in order to counter Etereal Shift. The intial stage of his rescue attempt to save Asuna got botched horribly when he went at it on his own, and only succeeded later on thanks to the efforts of Suguha, the combined might of the Guilds, Yui and even Asuna herself(and ultimately, Kayaba).   And in Alicization, Almost every one of his major fights were won thanks to Eugeo and/or Cardinal having his back since nearly all of the Knights that he fought are on his level of skill and higher.   Alice in particular was one of his strongest opponents to date as he could barely hold any ground against her on his own and needed to double-team her with Eugeo to stand any sort of chance against her. 

      And I don't even need to touch the final battle with Quinella, or his current situation after the fact. TUSF covered that adequately.

      As for Yuuki, it's explained that the reason why she is stronger than he is because she's spent a good majority of her life in a virtual world, meaning that her online experiences eclipse Kirito's two years in SAO. Kirito even goes as far as to say that if Yuuki was in SAO, she would've gained the Dual Blades ability much sooner than he did and would've have been more skilled at it as well.  So no, Reki isn't BSing on just how ridiculously OP Yuuki is.

      So, it's completely wrong to say that Kirito wins because he is innately better than everyone, or receives a deus ex machina to help him claim victory when he clearly doesn't. He has a consistent tendency of either nearly dying when he fights on his own, or needs someone else to help/save him.  And as of the recent arc, he is in serious need of the latter.

      On topic, it is hard to say because it's always been ambiguous about who is better than the other.  Kirito thinks Asuna is better than he is (and very early on in Progressive, she's shown to be faster than him), and Asuna believes him be likewise.  The one time that they actually dueled one another required Kirito to kinda cheat with an outside skill in order to beat her after fighting for 20 minutes. 

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    • WARNING: HEAVY SPECULATION

      I do not think that Kirito went all out on Yuuki. My reasoning is that it has been stated numerous times that Kirito loses some aspects of awareness when going all out and also has difficulty recalling details or entire periods of said outbursts. However in Mother's Rosario, Kirito was able to recite a sentence from mid-battle with Yuuki. From this it can be seen that Kirito was holding back to some extent. On two unrelated side notes, Asuna wouldn't have survived Mother's Rosario if she didn't retain her SAO stats, as stated in ME7, and that XaXa had a weapon of at least equal quality to Kirito's in BoB, the only reason behind the vastly different outcome being Kirito landing a direct hit with a high-damage sword skill (Double Circular) and not XaXa.

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    • Kirito reset all of his stats from SAO at the end of the Alfheim Online arc, that's why he couldn't beat Yuuki

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    • 14.19.157.87

      "Kirito reset all of his stats from SAO at the end of the Alfheim Online arc, that's why he couldn't beat Yuuki"

      Gonna quote Gsimenas on another thread for that:

      Unlike SAO, ALO is a personal skill-based game, meaning that one's equipment and stats only have a minor influence on one's battle performance.

      And as for the sources:

      Gsimenas wrote:

      Volume 3, chapter 2 (real books don't have CTRL + F nor copy-paste, so I can't give you the Yen Press version page number)

      She didn't know Nagata would start playing ALO with her. However, due to his exhaustive and exhausting lecture, Suguha had adapted to the game with amazing speed, and she found she was very good at the game. There were two reasons for this: The first reason is that Suguha had been doing Kendo for many years and the skills learned there were very effective for fights in ALO.

      [...]

      In addition, ALO is not a level-based game. So despite logging far less time than the most experienced players, she was able to match up with some of the best fighters in ALO. In fact, Leafa's numerical parameters were average and lower than most old players but because it ran off a purely skill-based system, she was considered one of the top Sylph players.

      And another quote from the same chapter but at an earlier time:


      ALO's attack formula is not complicated. It depends on four things: Power of the weapon itself, where on the opponent's body the attack hits, attack speed, and the armor worn by the opponent. On this occasion, the attack power of his weapon was almost the lowest, while the Salamander's armor was really quite high level. The strength of his attacks came from the boy's accuracy and overwhelming speed.

      I truly wish that were to be the case, and it was the stats that made a difference (I was the one that started this thread a few months ago believing Kirito lost because of some other reason than a pure skill difference after all) but one simply can't argue with solid facts bruh.


      @203.176.181.37

      "Reki himself said that Kirito would have lost."

      Quoting Gsimenas again... XD

      During the Q&A portion of it, the author replied to reader questions as the characters, unless the question was directed at him and not at a character. The question you're referencing was directed at Kirito.

      Here's the translation made by Tap (http://www.taptaptaptaptap.net/sao-qna-kirito/):


      Q. Did you go with Dual Blades in the tournament match with Absolute Sword? A. No, I went with one sword, but I probably wouldn’t win even with two.
      So, this doesn't really counter the argument. It was just about how Kirito believed that he would have lost either way.
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    • i just dont get why i mean kirito was already op why would he reset

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    • Gsimenas
      Gsimenas removed this reply because:
      Unneeded
      17:29, July 21, 2015
      This reply has been removed
    • 50.156.46.112 wrote: i just dont get why i mean kirito was already op why would he reset

      He reset because his OP settings were from his old SAO avatar and he wanted to end that Kirito's journey and start a new one in ALO and New Aincrad.

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    • The author did state however that If Kirito had used the Excalibur, he probably would've won due to different stats. I think Yuuki is stronger and everything but overall I think Kirito and Yuuki are somewhat equal :)

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    • But when Kirito and Zekken fought, she did not ask Kirito for help. But she asked Asuna. 


      Kirito saw through her. Mid-fight he said something like "you really are living in this world" She didn't want his help because he knew her secret. 

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    • Can I just say that it doesn't matter who wins in some cases because if kirito was op like many people want him to be he'd be as boring as super man against anything not involving kryptonite or doomsday

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    • Yeah. Kirito somehow figured out that Yuuki was literally living in the virtual world, and Yuuki didn't want to ask for his help because he figured that out. Kirito IS stronger than Asuna, but Yuuki didn't select him because he was able to put the puzzle pieces together.

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    • The three of them are nearly equal. Yuuki has extremely high reaction speeds and a 11-hit OSS, Asuna has thrusts with such speed not even Kirito can reliably parry them, Kirito can dual wield, use Skill Connect and Magic Blast. In short, they are all VERY strong players all around, they just specialize in different areas.

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    • As mentioned, Yuuki has the ability to react at speeds higher than Kirito and it's acknowledged by the author that without Excalibur's stat increase, he would legitimately lose against her. He even said that Dual Wielding wouldn't make a difference. As for Asuna and Kirito, both of them are stated and shown to be on similar levels in the series, with Asuna having greater attack speed while Kirito has superior reaction speed. Like Gsimenas said, it's hard to say which one of them is stronger.

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    • Don't twist the author's words. He didn't say that he would lose without Excalibur, he said that Excalibur's stat difference would have probably made a difference. And he didn't say anything about dual wielding.

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    • NO! Kirito is stronger ofr many, many reasons. First, he has the holdy blade and if his uses his dual blades ability he will destroy Asuna. Kirito as better reaction speed and he said to be stronger by Zekken. The reason she chose Asuna is because Kirito figured out her secret. 

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    • 1.40.4.148 wrote:

      First, he has the holdy blade

      Which he practically never uses and we don't know what's so good about it.

      and if his uses his dual blades ability he will destroy Asuna.

      Personal opinion. Any proof to back it up?

      Kirito as better reaction speed

      That doesn't guarantee him victory. Especially against someone who he has trouble keeping up with.

      and he said to be stronger by Zekken.

      False. She never made comparisons. She only said that he was "also" strong.

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    • I think Kirito is strong, but I also think Asuna is too. Besides, everything everyone's saying has absolutely no proof.

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    • Asuna has stated in the light novels that she can't stand up to Kirito. It was the side chapter with Lisabeth.

      “Should I say that he’s unpredictable, or that he just takes everything at his own pace... yet in spite of all that, he’s really strong.” (Asuna)

      “Oh, stronger than you?”(Lisbeth)

      “Yeah, like really; if we dueled, I wouldn’t even last one minute.” (Asuna).

      They might be closer now but Kirito doesn't take games as seriously as he did when they were life and death. Even with Yuuki's sword skill in her possession; I doubt the result would change. There's no definitive way to tell for sure as they haven't fought since Rosario but If she was that far behind in Aincrad then the result is probably the same.  

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    • That's a personal opinion. Both Kirito and Asuna think that they're weaker than the other, but they're at around the same level. Just that they have different fighting styles.

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    • If you can find me where Kirito has stated that he thinks he can't beat you then I'll admit that it's probably a personal opinion but otherwise; She has said she can't beat him and unfortunately we'll never really get a definitive answer because they're not going to fight each other so that's really the hardest evidence for either case.

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    • They've already had a duel in the canon doujinshis where they had a disagreement over using NPCs as fodder. What followed was a battle that went on for 20 minutes straight with neither gaining an advantage until Kirito had to use a Martial Arts Skill to take her off guard in order to beat her. And in SAO Progressive Volume 1, Kirito outright admitted that her attack speed with a rapier was so swift that he couldn't keep track of her sword at all. In the same volume, when they had a contest between them about who could kill 50 enemy bees, he realized that he was lagging behind her on kills, so he again had to resort to using Martial Arts Skill mixed with his Sword Skills to keep pace with her.

      So, in at least two occurances, Kirito has had to fall back on tricks outside of his swordsmanship to beat Asuna.

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    • idk but when someone already thinks he would lose at the start he would lose even with greater strength or power.Yuuki on the other hand has a purpose in winning . i think they are equal strength but just have different drive

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    • WolfLord315
      WolfLord315 removed this reply because:
      01:39, June 13, 2017
      This reply has been removed
    • kirito is slower than asuna because he has heavier sword(s)

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    • 99.139.78.149 wrote: kirito is slower than asuna because he has heavier sword(s)

      The weight of a sword has nothing to do with who is better. And the weight doesn't affect Kirito because he can wield the swords just fine.

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    • "Zekken" did not choose Kirito for the team, because Kirito understood that she would be 24 hours connected to the NerveGear. He actually asked her during the fight about it. Kirito is actually stronger than Asuna. The proof is pretty much that he got the dual bllading skill instead of Asuna (the strongest player of SAO got that skill).

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    • It's not "strongest player", it's "player with fastest reaction time".

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    • And even then, he's repeatedly commented that he can't see Asuna's attacks. Hell, he said that throughout Volume 1 of the original LN and Progressive.  Kirito has the fastest reaction time and Asuna has the swiftest attack speed.  They're both fast and strong in their own rights.

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    • I'll add my $.02 to the debate here. There are differences between each of them. Asuna's speed is incredible and Kirito admits that he can't see the attacks. That doesn't mean that he can't block them. Due to his incredible reaction speed, he has a very good chance of doing so, as he proved to her during a duel. He is also shown to react to attacks even before he sees them which is another indicator of his reaction speed.

      As for him fighting Yuuki, I don't think he was taking it as seriously as he could have. This is not the SAO Kirito, but a Kirito who has left, or at least keeps trying to leave if Kikuoka would actually let him, that part of his past behind. Even with his rolled back stats, he still has all of the skill and experience he gained there, even if it isn't reflected in something as ephemeral as stats. There's essentially three kinds of Kirito here. There's the more laid back Kirito who is doing it to have fun. There's the serious Kirito who is still having fun, but having to take the fight seriously. And then there's the Kirito who is no longer playing around because it is no longer a game. The latter Kirito is a whole different animal from the other two, as that means he's bringing out his SAO persona. That Kirito would have eaten Yuuki for lunch, as he would not be playing around and would have gone straight for the proverbial kill, as to him, it wouldn't be a game.

      At the same time, someone who knows how that persona fights can counter it, especially if they have a weapon tailored to counter the weapon being used. I don't know how many of you have wielded a sword or sparred with one, but the weight of the weapons clashing make a major difference, and that difference actually bit Kirito in the ass when he fought XaXa more than his skills being rusty. XaXa was wielding a custom made Estoc made of high grade materials, and using it against Kirito's lightsaber. A much heavier, not to mention dense, weapon versus a light one like that? Kirito's own muscle memory and reflexes bit him in the ass hard as he was actually trying to block more often, rather than parry or dodge.

      As for Heathcliff, I need to remind you that yes, it was due to a mistake. Again, his own muscle memory worked against him, but he was also tired from an already exhausting fight. Compare it to when he first fought the man in a duel. He was rested, and keep in mind that he forced Heathcliff to use Over Assist after he broke through his guard.

      Now, we get to another important point. Most of Kirito's victories were due to him having help. This is actually a good point to make, as it doesn't detract from his strength. Kirito can be the best out there. He could be the strongest. He could even be the fastest. But most of the major fights he ended up in weren't ones he could win on his own. He had even made a point in the series after he lost to Heathcliff and was made to join the Knights of Blood. He had reached the limit of what a solo player can do on his own, and he is an exceptional and rare case.

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    • Well, we can't make any conclusion on how Yuuki would do against a serious SAO Kirito.  That dwells into speculative territory that would just go in circles.  However, Kirito and Reki's own assessments indicate that she could've gained Dual Blades faster than Kirito in SAO since her reaction speed is higher than his own.  As for Asuna and Kirito's duel in Progressors, that is also up in the air. They both went at each other for a half an hour and neither was gaining any ground until Kirito used a Outside Skill as a feint to throw her off-balance and disarm her.  So, that indicates that they are mostly equal to one another.

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    • Well if you're talking about Kirito and Asuna in attack speed... A rapier would be naturally faster, being a rapier that i,. if asuna was to use a sword I reckon that she would be dramatically slower.

      As for Yuuki she is stronger than Kirito and Asuna.

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    • I am going to reference the SAO: Progressive LNs here. If they were all using the same model of Nerve-Gear then I reckon Kirito would have been stronger than Yuuki, even without dual-wielding or Excalibur, as her main advantage was the Medicuboid (or something like that) that allowed for better AI interfacing and allowing her to maintain a higher reaction speed from RL. Asuna is faster than Kirito in attack speed and is most likely stronger in terms of DPS because of that, but her main weaknesses if she were to fight Kirito are the fact he has more combat experience, better knowledge of games and skills and would probably be able to predict her skills more than she could of him.

      In SAO, Kirito keeps saying that Asuna is faster than him. The fact that Asuna is faster than Kirito is confirmed fairly other in SAO: Progressive as he even says that he was most likely going to party with her until he believes she'd be fine on her own as her main problem was her resolve in completing the game and allowing it to be more than just a death-trap forced upon her. Kirito would probably win in an all-out duel due to his combat experience and slyness. It's impossible to say for definite that Kirito is stronger than Asuna or that Yuuki is stronger than Kirito as there are too many things that affect it.

      Now, onto the GGO part that annoyed me in this section as people seem to missing the obvious. Kirito's sword was shitter than Death-Guns, as Death-Guns was player-made and tailored to his style where-as Kirito's was not. Death-Gun and Kirito's fight was also hard to determine who was stronger over-all as their stats were different, equipment was different and Death-Gun had an over-all better knowledge of GGO as shown through his trickery and the fact he used the game as a front to kill people.

      In the end, there's only one absolute definite in all the SAO arcs; Argo's the best player. She survived without fighting and saved the front-players at least twice (so far in SAO: Progressive) through her knowledge of the game and slyness which eventually leads to the clearing of the game - Argo was a very important factor as she brougth Kirito and Asuna together and caused the defeat of at least two floor bosses.

      This ends all my points now, feel free to say they're wrong or point out inconsistencies.

      - Not a random contributor, just couldn't be bothered to login in... Karma. -

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    • Oh before I forget. Heathcliff had to use system-assists to beat Kirito in their duel, he probably would have won anyway but I just had to add that in.

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    • 92.18.223.168 wrote:
      Oh before I forget. Heathcliff had to use system-assists to beat Kirito in their duel, he probably would have won anyway but I just had to add that in.

      This debate is old, but I'm going to support this: In Kirito's and Heathcliff's second fight, Heathcliff doesn't use his "System over assist" like before, and he was still beating Kirito. Heathcliff would have beaten Kirito without cheating, assuming Asuna didn't interfere. The only reason he cheated the first time was because he under estimated him (or something to that effect)

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    • I have to say this though the "best player" in SAO, in my opinion, is the one who prevented the most deaths and aided the most in floor clearing, Argo the Rat.

      - Karma - 

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    • It doesn't really matter.. Does it??

      This arc was made for Asuna fans so that she gets to be the main character..

      But she never really told Yuuki the reason she could find her was Kirito, also everything she could help Yuuki was possible due to Kirito.. That would've made the story similar to other arcs...

      This arc only made people cry... I wouldn't want to see another arc like this.. Honestly, I expected the people who died in SAO to be alive, but the story was supposed to be sad that way... I hate it..

      And about the strongest player.. It has to be Yuuki, she could smile while facing death at such a young age, while trying her very best to live... Kirito could be a stronger gamer and a genius.. But he's not strong and mature compared to Yuuki. though he's stronger than Asuna..

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    • Honestly, I gotta go that Kirigaya (Kirito) and Yuuki (Asuna) are equal.

      I haven't read the manga, or really looked into the anime that I watch. But through the proof I see above, I know that they are the same strength. I want to keep this simple, no evidence to back this up cause I'm lazy. But I'm just stating my opinion.

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    • Kirito struggled against Xaxa also due to the lack of compatibility between their weapons.Kirito used  Lightsaber knowing that it could cut or vaporise anything but it was incapable of cutting Xaxa's <<spaceship metal>> sword , so he could not defend himself by blocking it as it would simply pass through to hit him.This was a horrible compatibility issue for Kirito's sword.

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    • I think that Kirito with legendary weapon is stronger than Asuna. Even Sensei confirmed that Kirito with Holy Sword Excalibur is stronger than Yuuki. A fact that he doesn't want to use it for his personal gain is other thing.

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    • I believe that Kirito is the strongest. Kirito has the fastest reaction time. It has been discussed previously in this forum that Kirito can easily block most of Asuna's attacks in a duel. Also if we go to the Phantom Bullet arc, Kirito was easily able to slice all the bullets that came his way. And you may be thinking that he had prediction lines, but that is not enough to, prediction lines tell you where the bullets go but not when they will hit you. So for a normal person with average reaction time they could easily mistime the swinging of the blade. Kirito also sliced a bullet from Sinon's Hecate II, again it's not enough to look through the other side of the scope because of the issue of where but not when. You could say that Kirito could've used the sound of the shot but have you ever heard the saying "you never hear the bullet that hits you" so Kirito could not rely on sound. This just shows how fast he can react and supports the fact that Kirito could block Asuna's attacks while it would be hard for her to do the same with Kirito. As for Yuuki well I'd he can block a bullet from a powerful sniper then he can definitely block a swing from a sword no matter how fast as it cannot be faster than a bullet. But he lost because he wasn't bothered to win. So that's my theory.

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    • Yuuki was supposed to be more skilfull than Kirito. She has spent way more time in the VR and tbh,the author  wanted her to be remembered for her strength. Dual-weilding Kirito might be able to defeat her,but we cannot say for sure.

      Asuna and Kirito are well matched ,really. Asuna wins in speed and presicion while Kirito wins in other aspects.

      Xaxa was a tough opponent too,even considering the handicap Kirito had.

      Well,Alice is also an equal to Kirito. Kirito lost to her in a duel. Ofc,he was not dual weilding,but that is not very relevant as he had trouble blocking her attacks in the first place.

      Eugeo was also a natural with the sword,almost equal to Kirito even with lesser experience.

      Kirito almost died while fighting the Highest Minister,even while DualWing.

      He is not as OP as people make him out to be. 

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    • urm... for zekken vs kirito

      one thing for sure, kirito will lose

      since he's not in any of the situation that'll make him goes all out

      Aincard = death game , Alfhiem = revival with penalty

      so SAO version of kirito is no longer around

      plus, in the battle

      kirito just having fun, and he technically lose with timeout

      which is a different case if its a deathmatch

      and importantly, kirito didnt use his best skill in ALO

      which is that 5 combo weapon breaker skill



      while in alicization arc, kirito is teachnically himself with his human stats ( mental strength there are neglectedm if not wrong)

      which wouldnt makes a difference even he is an experienced fighther  in VRMMO

      so he should and would lose to those in the tower

      since they are genetically engineered to be much stronger than a normal being unlike kirito


      P.S pardon me if my understanding is wrong , lol

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    • In Alicization, Kirito is much weaker than Alice in strength.Even if they both go all out,it would be difficult to decide who wins. Kirito has an advantage in the sense that he uses more tricks and moves,but when it comes to pure swordsmanship,Kirito loses.He is not too good at <Sacred arts> too.

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    • 79.69.226.211 wrote:
      I believe that Kirito is the strongest. Kirito has the fastest reaction time. It has been discussed previously in this forum that Kirito can easily block most of Asuna's attacks in a duel. Also if we go to the Phantom Bullet arc, Kirito was easily able to slice all the bullets that came his way. And you may be thinking that he had prediction lines, but that is not enough to, prediction lines tell you where the bullets go but not when they will hit you. So for a normal person with average reaction time they could easily mistime the swinging of the blade. Kirito also sliced a bullet from Sinon's Hecate II, again it's not enough to look through the other side of the scope because of the issue of where but not when. You could say that Kirito could've used the sound of the shot but have you ever heard the saying "you never hear the bullet that hits you" so Kirito could not rely on sound. This just shows how fast he can react and supports the fact that Kirito could block Asuna's attacks while it would be hard for her to do the same with Kirito. As for Yuuki well I'd he can block a bullet from a powerful sniper then he can definitely block a swing from a sword no matter how fast as it cannot be faster than a bullet. But he lost because he wasn't bothered to win. So that's my theory.

      Yuuki has faster reaction time.

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    • Well, remember what lisbeth said, she said Kirito wont have to fight foreals ever again & reki probably regrets making Yuki OP, and also when kirito cuts the magic apart he said that the fastest magic is slower than a sniper bullet or whatever and yuki with a surprised face. Get this to your head, not all MC will be the strongest. Reki truly mest up his own story/work, kirito seemed to defeat  yuki  but he ran out of time, and yuki with a shocked face. Dual wields and with the holy sword that would be OP. I sometimes wonder to my self why reki didnt want to put kirito dualwield agaisnt yuki and that it wouldnt make a difference that made me laugh because he then said with the holy sword there could of been a difference so id say holy sword and dual wielding that could of destroyed her. He stated yuki was stronger and he cant go back so he just leaves is how it is. I wont even talk about asuna, its clear he is stronger, asuna said it herself when talking to lisbeth. And ever since reki made yuki, he made kirito look weak by saying those things, like i said prob deep inside reki he regrets making her OP. (:

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    • I don't think Reki would regret anything.

      You see the trend,Yuki was stronger than Kirito,she dies in a few chaps. .

      Eugeo too same story.

      Unless you are in kirito's harem, being stronger than him means you are gonna die.

      It is a nice way to handle things ,if you ask me.

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    • Haha thats prob the reason why reki made yuki pass away, because he wanted kirito to be the strongest again, and about  her having the fastest reaction speed why didnt she move a single muscle when kirito was about to defeat her. Kirito is a nice guy, he knew yuki was in the hospital and was on the verge of dying, he let her be #1, he smiled when yuki beat him, its ilogically stupid how reki decided to put this drama on the both of them. & with eugene he destroyed him when he used dual wields and he wasnt even using the holy sword. Its just dumb how people say it wouldnt make a huge difference if he used dual wield agaisnt her. I also finded funny how the "strongest' ended up dying, thats what i meant when i said reki regrets making her OP, and yuki only chose asuna over kirito because she reminded of her sister that passed away, and didnt choose kirito because he found out her secret. 

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    • OneSingularity wrote: In Alicization, Kirito is much weaker than Alice in strength.Even if they both go all out,it would be difficult to decide who wins. Kirito has an advantage in the sense that he uses more tricks and moves,but when it comes to pure swordsmanship,Kirito loses.He is not too good at <Sacred arts> too.

      We also have characters like Fanatio, Bercouli, Eugeo, Deusolbert who are on the same skill level as Kirito and higher. In fact, he's needed help fighting with almost all of the aforementioned with someone who was on equal footing to stand a chance (Eugeo). As for Asuna vs Kirito, yeah, it is worth addressing because in the narrative introspection of the characters, Kirito states as much as Asuna that he believes her to be stronger than he is and vice versa. The one time they fought, Kirito only won by using an Martial Arts Skill to take her off-guard after dueling for twenty minutes. So yeah, he mostly relies on Outside System Skills or other tricks to gain an advantage in a fight when fighting someone the same footing as him.

      And his battle with Eugene is a horrible example as well. Kirito only managed to win that fight after he made an opening in Eugene's defense by deflecting Eugene's blade's Ethereal Shift with the second blade, then whaled on him without giving the latter a chance to react while he was still in shock.

      And this whole notion that Reki wants Kirito to be the ultimate, unbeatable MC is ridiculous because all of his major victories have involved assists or saves from his friends. SAO: Progressive also highlights this even more. The few times he's gone at it on his own without outside help never works well for him, like with Heathcliff, Gleam Eyes, Nicolas the Renegade: all of which have nearly led to his death. Hell, Alicization has been all about him getting his ass handed to him by people explicitly stronger than he is if it weren't Eugeo being there to back him up as his combat partner. His final battle with Quinella, with everyone sacrificing themselves to help him while he could only stand by helplessly, hit for home how truly powerless he was. And if it weren't for Cardinal, Alice and Eugeo, she would've killed him.

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    • isnt the kirito from aliciziation arc just a the human kirito since he lost his memories??? 

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    • He doesnt remember being in sao or alo? so he doesnt know his sword skills etc. Or im wrong i think

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    • & of course kirito will be saved by his friends, hes the nicest person out there. He opens peoples hearts, he might not be stronger than the others but he can pull it off sometimes. 

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    • To answer all together:

      No, he's still Kirito. He lacks his SAO stats but his skill hasn't changed. And while he initially suffered some temporary amnesia due to brain damage, he quickly regained his memories during his first trip in PA and started applying his knowledge of Sword Skills.

      And in regards to his friends, that wasn't what you were arguing. You stated that Reki wants Kirito to maintain his position as the best amongst his friends and allies, when actual evidence in the novels swiftly contradicts that claim:


      • Asuna is alluded several times in the series to be his equal due to her speed and precision surpassing his while he exceeds her in other areas.
      • Kayaba outright beat him in their final duel *without* System Assist. (Note: I don't consider Kayaba amongst Kirito's friends for obvious reasons, but I figure he somewhat loosely fits into the Ally category after he helped him beat Sugou and rescue Asuna in ALO)
      • Eugeo grows to be his equal in a short span of time thanks to Kirito's training.
      • Yuuki is explicitly stated to have faster reaction times than Kirito due to spending far more time VR gaming than he has.
      • Alice is flat-out stronger than him. Period.

      Also, suggesting that Kirito smiling was indication of him holding back is insulting. First of all, Kirito himself admitted in a Q & A that he doubted that even if he used Dual Wielding, he wasn't sure that it would help him against Yuuki in a straight-up fight. Secondly, as her friend, he would not belittle her by toying with her. If that had been the case, she would've resented him for it.

      He smiled for the same reason Asuna did when she fought Yuuki, because he enjoyed the fight.

      And as I pointed out, he needed his friends' help to win those life-or-death battles or he would've died a long time ago. This doesn't even just extend to battles but his situations. For instance, if not for Asuna managing to get the administer's card key in ALO, as well as the help of Yui and the Guilds, his attempt at saving Asuna would've been utterly fruitless.

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    • I'm gonna end my part in this discussion with one more word (hopefully, because this thread seems like it's run its course). I personally don't believe that neither Asuna nor Kirito are explicitly stronger than the other. They excel in their own specialties while lacking in other attributes and honestly, I think that's the whole point of them as a pair in battle. When they fight together, they are the ultimate team because they emphasize on their respective strengths while covering for their weaknesses.

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    • You know, I think a look at his personality would really help. Kirito never let out his monster self except in SAO and ALO (to the best of my knowledge). Also, we see that if he really lets loose, he can even beat Heathcliff on his best day. It was just a difference of knowledge as Kirito didn't know as much as Heathcliff (Kayaba) about his opponent's power and skills. That said, he really would bury Yuuki in an all-out battle in SAO, even factoring in Mother's Rosario. Kirito never stated that he would never win against her. Also I can't vouch for much in the Alicization arc, seeing as I can't get the light novels in my area, but he is basically in Yuuki's position without the terminal disease twist from what I have read of it in this wiki so he would obviously be weak in that world. As for thos ewho went away from the topic in question(the discussion topic), we can easily conclude that Kirito draws his power from his friends, a popular concept in shonen manga (Bleach and Naruto reference here please) so it is impossible for Kirito to lose in a battle where his friends' lives are at stake(SAO). Finally, why do we need to compare the stats of anyone in the first place? Isin't it better to just enjoy what is in store for us?

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    • Also, we see that if he really lets loose, he can even beat Heathcliff on his best day.

      He would have been easily killed if Asuna hadn't intervened. And he only managed to win on his deathbed. By defying the system.

      Kirito never stated that he would never win against her.

      Actually, he did. In a web version Q&A.

      but he is basically in Yuuki's position without the terminal disease twist from what I have read of it in this wiki so he would obviously be weak in that world.

      It doesn't work that way in Alicization.

      Anyway, since this is a topic about Kirito and Asuna, not Yuuki, I will be removing any other conversations about Kirito versus Yuuki. Because seriously, we already have topics for those.

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    • This is both a difficult and easy topic to tackle. If you HAD to strip them down to their basic forms, Kirito has years of kendo training under his belt and he uses one handed broadswords, while Asuna uses a style close to fencing. Kirito's strikes are heavy and typically made to end a fight in one stroke, whereas Asuna's are quick but designed to counter-attack. The match would be a stare down, whoever moved first would lose; Asuna's attack would be overpowered by Kirito's and Kirito's would be turned aside and reversed. So it comes down to a numbers game, which is easy in theory, but becomes difficult as we don't know what those numbers are exactly. SAO is fairly easy, Kirito was a higher level than Asuna, so it stands to reason that his numbers would be better and he would win. Those levels DID carry over to ALO, but both of them reset their characters and releveled from the beginning, making that all irrelevant. Their current levels are likely to be equal since they leveled together, meaning that their numbers are likely to be at least approximately equal as well. In-game skills are a factor that should be considered, but that is hard to track. While we know a few names for what they use, their actual damage, cast speed, etc is unknown and basically impossible to compare. Made up skills, such as Kirito's Skill Link, falls into a category that the Mass Effect 3 forums would call "clever use of game mechanics" that anyone can pull off with enough practice, at least in theory. That's when gear comes into play. Since Asuna's character is a hybrid fighter/caster, her gear stats should be split between magic and physical combat, so she'll be passible doing either role but not excel in either one, while Kirito's gear is better all around for close combat, and considering that he has Excalibur, the highest ranked item in ALO, he's sure to win should he decide to use it. So if both of them put all cards on the table to decide it once and for all, Kirito's numbers are higher in the end, so he wins.

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    • KiraTsukasa wrote:

      has years of kendo training under his belt

      He gave up on it at an early age though. So that doesn't really count as much experience.

      Those levels DID carry over to ALO

      Their current levels are likely to be equal since they leveled together, meaning that their numbers are likely to be at least approximately equal as well.

      ALO doesn't have levels. Skills and stats yes, but not levels.

      both of them reset their characters and releveled from the beginning

      Only Kirito did. The rest just imported their SAO characters. So technically, Asuna should have some sort of advantage (probably has slightly more HP). Though its relevancy is a different question, since ALO is a player skill-based game, not a level-based game. For example, Leafa is fully capable of competing with the top-ranked players, including the ones that grind a lot, despite having average stats due to not having that much free time to play all day.

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    • Actually, if any of you red the novel, it says that because Kirito was using a light sword, he couldn't intercept Xa-Xa's blade, but Xa-Xa had a really high agility and was able to avoid kirito's

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    • Necropost >.<

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    • Can we really decide for sure who's stronger between Asuna, Kirito and Yuuki? Sorry, a SAO newbie here so I don't know if it'll make sense but as mentioned numerous times above the author himself said that Dual Wielding would possibly have been of no use but Excaliber might have made up for the difference. But this statement at least confirms that Kirito might have put out much more with Excaliber and with the sword he could have possibly won. So Kirito wasn't using everything he could to win. Second, it can't been denied that not only his skills got a little rusty, he (and the SAO survivors) doesn't have that bloodlust and desparate need to survive the game which he did in SAO and Yuuki spent more time in VR using a more powerful machine that allowed much more immersiveness than its predecessors. And this one's my personal feeling but Yuuki must have felt the need to prove and belong, since it was the only world she could 'live' in.

      All this doesn't mean that Kirito was at a disadvantage or Yuuki had an advantage of sorts. To truly see whose stronger we need to see them fight with everything they have at that time, using all their options which Yuuki was doing and apparently Kirito was not. Things like he could have beaten her if he was at the same strength as SAO are the same as saying given enough training he could surpass her in the future and both of these statements have no validity.

      Honestly, I do feel that if Kirito used Excaliber he would have beaten her. Some might say its unfair that it was because of the sword and it doesn't show his strength but I don't think so, in a battle, your strength consists of not only your EXP, but your skills, items, weapons and in the same way the time she spent and experience got in VR with a more powerful gear might be said as something unfair but its not, its just an extra 'skill' she's got. 

      The interesting question's this, make everything same - skill, weapons, VR experience, their bloodlust and desparation, everything EXCEPT for their personal figting style. Who do you think would be stronger then?

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    • 1) Kawahara said that the use of Excalibur would give Kirito a possible win due to the stat difference, not due to Kirito's skill in any way.

      2) Kirito, in a Q&A, can be quoted on his knowledge that he is only at 80% of his peak (that being the end of SAO) and can also be quoted that he believes that Yuuki would win even if he were at his peak.

      Yuuki would still beat Kirito more often than not, even with Excalibur he's said to only probably be able to win.

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    • See that's why I said it can't be said for sure who's stronger b/w the 3? First, even though it could have been possible because of only the difference in stats, I'd still say Kirito is stronger. A weapon is an essential part of one's skill so even if extraordinarily powerful, unless its acquired by unfair means, the weapon is part of one's strength.

      Second, and mainly, all this is speculation. Kirito only believes that he'd lose and Excaliber just might make up for the difference and he'd win. None of these are well-established or confirmed facts. For example, even if Kirito beat Asuna just barely, with the use of some extra skill, I could say with certainty that at that moment, Kirito is stronger because as I said before, the skill is part of Kirito's strength. This is not a nuclear bomb vs missile where we know in raw power what's the more destructive. As a player, what makes your strength is your exp, power, skill, weapons, abilities and even your items. Some might have more exp while others might have more skills or powerful weapons. So if Kirito beat Yuuki with the help of Excaliber, I'd say he's stronger.

      Kirito might win with Excaliber but then again I've got nothing to support my statement either (or deny it) and that is why I can never say or admit for sure who's the strongest until I see a fight where they really went nuts using everything they got (which should be the case with opponents like Yuuki, Asuna - the opponents respect that as otherwise it is quite insulting to the one who's giving everything they have).

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    • As you say yourself - you're only speculating. ZeHaffen already quoted Kirito/Kawahara that Yuuki is better skilled. Don't beat the dead horse again and again.

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    • In episode 19, when Asuna accused Kirito of throwing the dual because Zekken turned out to be a girl, Kirito states that he was taking the dual seriously. BUT only about half of the way through. So he admittedly let up mid fight.

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    • For the hundreth time, he said he was taking it serious STARTING midway, not until midway. Crunchyroll mistranslated 途中からは as if it was 途中までは.

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    • What about the last episode of season 2 when they were in a dual and kirito was hit with the 9 hit combo, Mother's Rosario and with a inch of health still remaining, came back and almost finished Zekken with a headshot who only had a quarter bar of health, if not for the timer. Zekken was even on the ground in a trance because he came at her so fast with plenty of time to defeat her. So I think, like others have said, if it was a real battle, Kirito would have won. Though, Zekken is superior at the game aspect like Kirito pointed out.

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    • That only happens in the anime. In the LN, Yuuki straight-up reduces Kirito's HP to zero with Mother Rosario. There is no possible comeback or time limit.

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    • What Ryu Heishin said is correct, I'm just here to point out that Mother's Rosario is 11 hits, not 9.

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    • Just a silent reader here! I strongly believe that Kirito is stronger than Eugeo... (because someone said that Eugeo is) Kirito believes that Eugeo would surpass him one day because he has a talent.. But it never happened.. He defeated Eugeo when he was synthesized saying Eugeo cannot be him yet with that state. In terms of incarnation.. Kirito is stronger than anyone in Underworld.... (as said by Bercouli) :) Correct me if I am wrong.

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    • I would say Kirito is stronger than Asuna but it's close. And also in what I have seen, stronger than Yuuki too. But then of course, Kirito and Asuna haven't dueled each other so we dont really know as for the moment. But against Yuuki (Zekken) he may be stronger. If u noticed when Asuna (I think) said to Kirito that he may have been holding back, he showed that he did in a Gesture. Also in Kirito and Yuuki's fight of the timer had not ended Kirito would've won. Well thats for another topic, and this is just what I think.

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    • This discussion will probably never end, because we are humans and have different points of view. But I'm going to say mine: If there's something that I dislike about books, movies, animes, comics... Is when the author itself underestimates the character he/she has created. In SAO, we can see a lot of characters, but the main one is Kirito isn't he? Well, that said, it's obvious that nobody wants to read a book or comic where the main character gets ultra OP and with one hit beats everybody, but if somebody like Kirito, who has survived alone for a long tim, has done a lot of things in Sao and more... is treated like he is not important anymore,(not actually like that, but I think you understand me) I quite dislike it. Let's give the character the credit he/she deserves. But we've got to apply this to Kirito, Asuna, Yukki or everybody.Asuna is a very strong woman, just as Yukki. both of them with her problems, strengths and flaws... Yukki has more technology, and in general is better than everybody,that's for sure, but a Kirito wanting to do something, to defend somebody, it's like any character in any book or movie, simply unstoppable. btw, returning to the course of the monologue, let's give the pertinent credit to all the characters, and to Kirito, because he is strong and he is the main character for something, if not it would be Yukki for example, but she isn't. I'm not a Kirito super fan, I'm just defending the same feeling that I got with the Percy Jackson series (if you've read it you will know what I mean). In the second part of the books, Percy isn't the top character, and I understand it, but I think the whole thing could have went in a different way... for some reason I feel that the author did not give him the credit he deserved, he lost 4 years of his life fighting, he fought the war god at age 12 and beat him, and then he isn't even able to react against some lame stacks or something like that...(btw just my thoughts). I'm rambling, so returning to SAO, Kirito is very strong, just like Asuna or Yukki, but like a lot of characters, when the main character is moved with will, with conviction, when he/she fights for a cause... we've always seen he/she will do the impossible and be unstoppable. And it they have friends that follows them, better. Because they will save him/her in the moments of needs, because it not fun to always read or watch a one man/woman army. Well, that was long, hope you understand my point of view. I just think that they are all at the same level, but if Kirito is the real main charcter is for something, because his objective was to survive SAO and go back home, saving his friends, and he did it, with the help of said friends. So yeah...maybe that was confusing.

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    • Kirito seems much stronger than Asuna in terms of over all power and also level. If we think about it as a game which it is, Kirito goes a "stength" build in SAO. In SAOII Sterben also mentions Kirito's strength preference. His choice of weapon is a 2H sword but he uses one hand and can even dual-wield two 2H swords. Even with this weight he moves just as fast and faster than anyone in game. When dueling Akihiko, Kirito's power was overwhelming. This is coming from the perspective of someone who is already cheating, but had to increase the level of cheat settings to win against Kirito.The DW skill was given to the person with fastest reaction time. In terms of role, if both Kirito and Asuna were considered DPS or damage players, Kirito would be more of a bruiser or tanky-warrior. Although she was pretty strong, Asuna was a squishier damage-warrior type. In SAO ep.12 Kirito and Asuna go up against the "Unknown" reaper which we know neither one of them could solo. Kirito, having more experience says the reaper is probably from level 90. What is interesting about this scene is when the reaper attacks them. Kirito's health stayed in the green, but Asuna's dropped to yellow although she was standing behind him. 

      In SAOII ep.19, before Asuna meets Zekken/Yuuki she is discussing relative speed of the players and refers to Kirito's speed: "Speaking of fast moves, someone almost illegally speedy is napping over there." Both Yuuki and Kirito weren't going at full, Kirito more so because to him a simple duel isnt life and death. Kirito takes on a different persona when he is fighting for real SAO ep.14: "This isn't a duel...it's simply a fight to the death. Thats right. I'm going to kill this man." The reason Yuuki is more skilled is because the game is her life. Kirito has no reason to be strong anymore and he "will only go all-out when the game is no longer a game." Kirito also says that Yuuki would have been the one with the dual-wield ability and not him. Yuuki doesnt seem to be a lot better than Kirito because we have to remember the criteria for accessing the "dual-wield" setting was simply fastest reaction or put differently, fluidity of movements. This is to be expected from someone who lives in the game. We see this just for a moment when Yuuki deflects Asuna's sword in their duel.

      Going back to Asuna and Kirito comparsion, simply acquiring an "original sword skill" isnt enough to make someone stronger (Kirito vs General Eugene). Like a game there are many stats to consider. Both are fast characters. Kirito is most likely faster due to his SAO training/grinding and over all knowledge in game. Also his GGO training of deflecting bullets with a swordand dodging incoming bullets. We already know Kirito is tankier so he can take more hits. Since Asuna hasn't used the sword skill against Kirito we have to use the Kirito/ Yuuki duel as reference. In the duel Yuuki uses her special skill but Kirito only use his default (didn't duel wield). Kirito is shown to be a fast learner in SAO and SAOII in many instances, meaning he already knows Asuna's skills/ speed. The only thing we've seen him to not counter or parry was this special skill while he played with a handicap(not using his duel-wield) against Yuuki. Since this is the only advatage Asuna would have over Kirito, it is not enough to beat him if he went in full power.

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    • Mhn pretty sure Kirito was holding back because he figured out Yuuki's secret. On the other hand, Asuna had no idea about her condition so she went full on.

      Both Kirito and Asuna are strong but we may never know who's stronger unless they go head to head which will probably never happen lol

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    • A FANDOM user
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